For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways

[harp]

Foaming Rabid Canon Thumper(HP) :
1. An individual with the irrational, obsessive paranoia that somewhere on Earth, there is a person deriving happiness from the idea of a romantic relationship between Harry and Hermione.
2. An individual with the irrational, obsessive paranoia that somewhere on Earth, there is a person deriving happiness from the idea of a romantic relationship between a pairing that J.K Rowling has not confirmed as Canon either in books or interviews.

I reach out to the rabids here and ask a simple question- what is it to you? What is it to you if someone likes Harry and Hermione? You have gotten your way. Is it not enough? Do you not understand that at this point you anger is literally nothing more than being upset* because someone else might be happy?

I've invited a few people here to comment, but I swear on all that is holy that I will do everything I can think of to stop this from becoming a war zone, even if it means throwing my hands up and saying "fine". There's no wrong way to ship (in this post) but can't we try to be civil? I know we can. Just look at Harp and Heron!

Ships are about the love between two (or more) characters. Shipping is about getting together with people who think the same way and enjoying your similar interests together. Real fans celebrate their ship with fun and sharing "squee" because their enjoyment is independent of the kid down the block liking another ship.

The people I am seeing are people who can do nothing but make the fandom into a pissing contest. There is no enjoyment, only competition. They belittle not only people ("Delusional!") but concepts that could possibly make these people happy (such as a simple eight second dance scene). They only get pleasure from their ship by picking it up and using it to beat up another ship. They are not fans in any sense of the word.

*Note: I will gladly and without question accept and not argue with "I just like being cruel and nasty to people who don't share my ship views" because I appreciate the honesty

Also, I don't care if "so-and-so started it back in 1942". The wars are over; we all know what's canon, and that's just the way it is whether you got your way or not.

P.S- Free quick-and-dirty art in this post to anyone who wants it, regardless of ship

Comments

[mad-mediocrity.livejournal.com]

Okay, so continuing from our posts in the ARGH community ...

1. Totally un-related note, you are very talented in your artwork!

2. I'm posting here because it was the most recent HP related post I could find.

3. Why I appreciate R/Hr? Well, first of all, I can appreciate it as a "natural" thing to happen. The two of them have had a fair amount of sexual tension, IMO, leading back several books. Does it mean they're actually compatible with each other or in the long run? Hell no. But do I completely understand why R/Hr would happen? Yes. When you have that sexual tension and mutual physical interest in each other (which I feel they pretty obviously do), something has to eventually tip. I appreciate R/Hr happening simply because I find it's a realistic depiction of a lot of relationships.

4. Do I think they're compatible in the long run? Hell no. I really do think that they respect each other, which is key to a good long-term relationship and friendship. However, unless they both mellow out, they feed back on each other in a positive feedback loop that would only escalate conflict, not deflate it. Not conducive in the long run to a strong relationship in my opinion.

5. Personally, I think the charge that they have little in common is a reasonable statement to make for arguing against R/Hr, although it could go both ways. Having little in common isn't that big a deal as long as you're open to learning about the other, you respect each other, and you try to stay involved in each others' lives, I feel. Furthermore, what's equally important is sharing the same core values and belief systems, which I do feel that they do. However, unless they both mellow out, learn some humility, and give some ground to each other, I don't think R/Hr would be viable in the long-term because they wouldn't be able to bridge that lack of common interests.

And that's pretty much it for R/Hr for me. I appreciate it because I do think it's a common and realistic relationship dynamic, but at the end of the day, unless they both mellowed out, that push-pull dynamic that they have would fuck their relationship over and end any potential for something long-term and stable.

6. I know that a lot of people dislike Ron and I don't blame them. People like him (jealous and insecure), in real life, can rub me the wrong way too, but at the same time, they can also be attractive because of their completely readable and transparent vulnerability. To me, that kind of humanity is kind of heart-breaking and thus perversely attractive. (Hey, just being honest here.) As a literary character, I think he's great. I find him and Neville two of the more interesting and relatable male characters because of their totally unsubtle character flaws and weaknesses.

That said, I think despite Ron's insecurity, he's got his heart in the right place and he's pretty gutsy, although not as swashbuckling as Harry. And yeah, he can be petty, but he can also be chivalrous. I can understand why Hermione or any other girl would spring for him and respect him; he's very human and his character failings are acceptable in that they are very human flaws.

7. I'm gathering that you go for H/Hr, which is also great in my books. I see H/Hr as the relationship that could feasibly occur if/when R/Hr crashed and burned.

Personally, I don't buy that "they're so platonic" crap that's supposed to argue against H/Hr. They're platonic until they're not is the way I see that. Friendship morphing into a relationship is a pretty common and realistic trope for a reason, right?

That said, I personally don't think Hermione and Harry have too much in common either, although they too share the same base values, moreso than Ron and Hermione, IMO. So any relationship between the two would also have to work to bridge that gap.

Cont'd below ...

[harpsi-fizz.livejournal.com]

Thanks so much for coming by! Really! Wow... so much to say. First off, thanks very, very much for the kind words about my art. That's always first.

The second thing is a misconception I have to clear up very often- I'm not an HHR shipper. I just like H/Hr people and I feel bad for them. I ship Hermione with Lavender, Padma, or Luna. Harry I don't give a darn about enough to ship him with anyone. Yes, HHR does compliment my OTP (Draco/Ron, talk about a relationship of butting heads!) but I don't consider myself a shipper.

HHR shippers are the Lady, I'm the boy with the sword, and the nasty brand of OBHWFers are the dragon(s), and it's all because of goatsie, the guy who runs the mugglenet forum (bet you didn't know his name was goatsie!)

Your explanation on R/Hr shipping was beautiful. It was the whole "this love will last forever" thing that re-he-heally got to me. Then again, who is JK kidding? She ought to expect at least some of her characters would get divorced. The whole telling us the end pairings was a bad, control freak-y move, was it not?

I really love and appreciate you for your love of that ship. If I could just isolate myself and only watch you and Heron for a while, I'd be cured, I think. Only, that won't happen because I hang out in the GaiaOnline forums and there are always little snots crashing the HHR thread with nasty comments. It's, for some reason, never "H/G is the way!" but people waving the R/Hr flag.

(More in the second comment)

[mad-mediocrity.livejournal.com]

Hey there, happy new year. And I'm glad to hear that you appreciated my post and explanation!

I just like H/Hr people and I feel bad for them.

Heh, me too.

I ship Hermione with Lavender, Padma, or Luna.

Hm, yeah, I can see her with Padma. If I was to see Hermione in a queer relationship, I see her working pretty well with Cho, actually.

I really love and appreciate you for your love of that ship. If I could just isolate myself and only watch you and Heron for a while, I'd be cured, I think.

Aw, why thank you!

... But I'm sure many, many OBHWFers wouldn't consider me a "true" R/Hr shipper, since I pointed out all the ways that they're absofuckinglutely terrible for each other. I think there's a tendency for canon-thumpers to believe that just because Rowling wrote some random ship, it'll just magically be okay and the characters will "work" for each other and we readers just have to accept it.

Your explanation on R/Hr shipping was beautiful. It was the whole "this love will last forever" thing that re-he-heally got to me ... The whole telling us the end pairings was a bad, control freak-y move, was it not?

For the record, I could totally buy that R/Hr's love could last "forever," as implied by Rowling and canon-thumpers, but only IF big, huge changes and concessions were made in their relationship. But Rowling's damn epilogue, where they show the characters still pretty much having the exact same personalities as 20 years earlier, kind of negates that possibility.

The epilogue wasn't just kind of excessive from a control-freak POV, but also an example of bad writing and character development, IMO. She told us that everything is fine and peachy with all the final OBHWF pairings, but she didn't show any change in their personalities. And knowing what we know about their personalities and conflicts, it's hard to just buy her telling of their future lives.

Continued below ...

[harpsi-fizz.livejournal.com]

I should've done this for your first comment; I probably lost a lot of thoughts not doing this

many, many OBHWFers wouldn't consider me a "true" R/Hr shipper, since I pointed out all the ways that they're absofuckinglutely terrible for each other.
Hm. This reminds me of the people who sail on Asshole Central, AKA "The_HMS_STFU" and their definition of the community DeathToCapslock. Quote "Deathtocapslock is supposedly a mocking community that sporks different HP chapters. In reality it's a wanking community for butthurt Slytherfen and Harmonians"

It's actually not that at all. If they bothered to look at the community, they'd see that

1- the people in it are pointing out parts in the books that are inconsistent, nonsensical, or that they personally did not like.
2- Not every post represents the collective thought of everyone in the community, and in the comments, people disagree, partially agree, and discuss things.
3- The majority of the posts are little essays expanding on particular thoughts. For example, someone who made a "why I don't like Dumbledore" post, someone else made a post to discuss squibs, ect. I didn't comment on the Dumbledore post since I personally like Dumbledore.

Their language is quite telling. "Slytherfen", meaning "people who identify with Slytherin for their own reasons". But since so many bad wizards came from that house, the Canon can't-think-for-themselvesers think "that means the people who like that house are butthurt fans and bad/wannabe bad people."

It's the same case with those people who'd call you not-a-true-fan. What both groups have in common is that their faith and love is so fragile that they can't handle any naysaying. Whereas you and I and the people in DeathtoCapslock love the series so much that we can handle the blows of naysaying and criticism. If the three of us (you, the DtC community, and the Thumpers) were dating personifications of the series, they would be the ones who would never fight with their lovers and break up within a few years while you and the DtC would be able to say "you have imperfections, but that doesn't mean I don't love you."

As for the rest of your comment... well, that is perfect. I can't even think of anything to add to it. I agree with it completely.

[mad-mediocrity.livejournal.com]

Heh, I just looked at HMS_STFU. Holy crap, they need to get over themselves. Now, I think every ship has its fair share of wankiness, but jeez. Most of the people on STFU already got their way in canon; I don't see why they need to bitch about other people bitching.

But since so many bad wizards came from that house,

On a side-note, I was really disappointed that the house system still seemed to be in existence, as described in DH's epilogue. IMO, many, many events in the HPverse have illustrated that the houses have caused more damage than good.

you and the DtC would be able to say "you have imperfections, but that doesn't mean I don't love you."

Hahaha, I'm workin' on living up to this.

Poor Ron gets a bad reputation from the Harmony fans, which is a shame. I try hard to defend him to a lot of them, especially Brad. Weasley hate is stereotypical of Harmony fans.

I think many people in the fandom generally hold Hermione in high esteem and overlook her own failings. Consequently, she's the one that all the people "fight for," relationship-wise. I can understand why people hate on Ron; for one, it's easier to empathize with Harry, considering that the whole series is generally written from his POV. However, I don't know what came first - the OTP or the competing-character hate; a true chicken vs. egg puzzle! ;)